Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx

Posted by: orchid

Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx - 03/10/07 11:04 PM

It continues to floor me that modern societies/countries outside of North America, still mindlessly ask info. about a person's marital status, number of children and even a photo..for job applications/resumes.

I found out the German company I work for here in Canda , head office in Germany asks via their internet site, for such info. I am unimpressed.

Thank goodness for legislation in Canada (and probably U.S.) that makes it illegal to ask for this preliminary info. on job application forms/ in resumes.
Posted by: chickadee

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx - 03/11/07 04:22 PM

orchid, they say you should answer, "That is personal info, etc." but I can see that answer turning off the interviewer to even considering anyone for the position. What about asking a persons age? Does that fall under the same category?

chick
Posted by: Anno

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx - 03/11/07 05:24 PM

Actually, D has gone on a few interviews where they won't hire him until they have met the little wife. So it is not quite as great as we sometimes assume.
Posted by: orchid

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx - 03/13/07 05:09 AM

Quote:

Actually, D has gone on a few interviews where they won't hire him until they have met the little wife. So it is not quite as great as we sometimes assume.




Until they meet his wife to make a no hire/hire decision??? No offense to you, but that is truly prehistoric thinking. Does your hubby's work capabilities/skills in the workplace rest on you? Of course not. He could be fantastic at work, but be a crappy hubby or the reverse.

I can't imagine the surprise if they met my partner to make a hiring decision...about me. I would be beyond the pale for some folks and fail in terms of their definitions of predictability/stability. Just him being 16 yrs. older than I, already would throw some folks in a loop.

I do employee group training once a month. part of it is on how we collection documents from within our organization. I explain to our ex-patriate staff direct from U.K., germany, Philippines, etc. that my dept. cannot collect documents with personal info. nor any resumes which might offer marital status info., since alot of our ex-patriate staff unwittingly offer this info. when they don't even realize it's illegal for a Canadian employer to obtain your age, marital status, number of children, ethnicity, etc. prior to hiring you. They can ask about marital status and birth date,...after you have accepted the job offer....because employer needs it for benefits eligibility, etc.

And truly amazing, the reaction that I get from ex-pat. staff: "What, isn't that part of knowing you?" Yea, sure.

I had to explain to database reprogrammer, no let's choose Ms. for addressing a woman in a letter, cause we don't know if she's married, single or cohabiting. And who gives a poop --- for a business letter.

I was stunned to learn in the U.K., maybe an old company that for professional woman, they might be still addressed as Mr. in a letter. Jeez.... old, old thinking and practices.
Posted by: mrs_madness

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/13/07 08:14 PM

Ah lady, you have no idea how bad it can really get.

Here in Moscow employers who are recruiting always specify that the candidate be in a certain age range (ALWAYS under 30) and to send a portfolio of photos with the resume. Women over 35 are nearly unemployable no matter how experienced or qualified. I've heard stories till my ears could fall off about women who get booted from their jobs because they're too old, get application letters of rejection because they're too old (and too fat!), get propositioned in their jobs. This is a culture of put out or get out--no matter what *the law* says.

I know women right this moment with advanced degrees in mathematics and the sciences who are pushing a mop for a living because they are not young and cute. Russian women over 40 cannot get a job that pays a living. Period.

And wait, it gets even worse. My friend told me about her husband's New Year's party in the corporate office. The company had a director's office decked with a bed and other accouterments....and a hooker was hire for the occasion. All of the male employees were expected to partake in the festivities.

I personally know firsthand of several young Russian women who lost their jobs because they refused the sexual advances of bosses and clients. Fired, out the door, goodbye. It is expected that these services will be provided and girls who don't go along have a very bumpy and unsuccessful career.

I have a great deal of trouble actually being served here, anywhere. I sometimes cannot get into restaurants, I've been refused entry into nightclub and dance club places. I've given up on going out to a lot of places because I know they're not going to let me in. My husband--yes. Me--no. It's young and cute or your fanny is out at the bus stop.

It's a beating. You all don't know how good you've got it. And it's going on all over the world.
Posted by: SharonE

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/14/07 12:57 AM

I'm shocked . What can we do for our sisters in Russia?
Posted by: orchid

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/14/07 04:20 AM

Wow, pretty shocking about Russia. Wonder when real change will occur. What will it take..to make permanent change.
Posted by: Edelweiss

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/14/07 04:42 AM

You should read the newspaper adds in Germany...same thing...they state whether they want a male, female or both...the put in the age range and sometimes if the person should be married or single. The women here totally accept that …. Strange.

Thank God it's not as bad in Germany as in Russia.
Russians living in Germany do not have a good reputation, although they are a diligent and clean people. The growing Russian Mafia (drug rings) is supposed to be more brutal than the Sicilian Mafia ever was. The Russians tend to clan. They have overtaken entire neighbourhoods and shun any non-Russian person there…so that over the years the Germans and other nationalities have moved from those neighbourhoods.

It seems to me Russia is going crazy with its newfound freedom and wealth and is sowing its oats by going through a decadence period. Would you agree Mrs. Madness?
Posted by: mrs_madness

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/14/07 05:40 AM

Russians everywhere do not have a good reputation. Russians need visas to travel to almost any country and single Russian women simply cannot get visas, they have such a *reputation*.

I have heard that a lot of the prostitutes in Amsterdam where prostitution is legal, are Russians. Someone recently told me that a lot of the 'showgirls' in Vegas are Russians. The EU actually formally complained to the Russian government about a few years ago about the flood of Russian women in the sex industry in western Europe, and I believe that it was in 2004 or 2005 that Russia finally passed its' FIRST human trafficking legislation. Fat lot of good it did anyway. The law is meaningless here.

Here's a really good one: About 2 summers ago the entire Russian diplomatic team was deported from Helsinki Finland for running a prostitution ring of Russian women out of their diplomatic housing!

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack this thread.....
Posted by: Edelweiss

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/14/07 06:01 AM

The prostitution rings in Germany are pretty much Russian run...and the Polish ladies are right up there too.

Got to admit though, the Russian women are stunningly beautiful. Just look at the tennis players. Too bad so many have to resort to "that" profession.
Posted by: Lola

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx - 03/14/07 07:00 AM

[quote I was stunned to learn in the U.K., maybe an old company that for professional woman, they might be still addressed as Mr. in a letter. Jeez.... old, old thinking and practices.




That's quite right, Orchid. I am addressed as Esq (Esquire) in correspondence but only at first instance. Further correspondence reverts in the form I wish to be addressed i.e. first name basis or titular, depending on familiarity with my counterpart. The protocol in the legal profession usually address correspondence in the masculine form in the same way countries are referred to in the feminine form because of the personality they are given. There is nothing, however, that would restrict one from using "Sir/Madam" salutations should one choose to deviate. It is just not the common practice within the legal profession. I have still to come across any form of complaints from any of my counterparts at other law firms when it is presumed they are men. Perhaps, it is because further correspondence and the accompanying conduct allow for the women in my profession to rectify that presumption. I have, on a few occasions, addressed a Vivien, Leslie, Marion and a Jocelyn, as a "Madam", only to discover that I should have referred to a "Sir".
Posted by: chickadee

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status questions,xx - 03/14/07 04:54 PM

This post is an eye opener. Our Russian sisters have a long way to go to catch up. Is there anything we can do? Are they(women) doing anything that you know of to make change, MrsM? I think you are right, it is happening elswhere.

chick
Posted by: orchid

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/15/07 03:39 AM

Quote:

You should read the newspaper adds in Germany...same thing...they state whether they want a male, female or both...the put in the age range and sometimes if the person should be married or single. The women here totally accept that …. Strange.




What would be the rationale to know about a woman's marital status in Germany?

And then there are employers internationally who ask for a face photo with resume.

Russian mafia operation much more widespread than believed.
Yes, throwing off the Communist shackles leads the herds to extremes of decadence and really corrupt practices. LIke taste of freedom they don't how to manage it properly and justly for the whole of society. Encompasses prostitution.
Posted by: mrs_madness

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/15/07 05:08 AM

For women, I think the rationale for asking marital status is to discover whether or not the lady in question will likely be taking [expensive] long term maternity leave. I have heard here that one reason employers favor young single women is that they are certainly less likely to become pregnant and disappear from work.

As for the photo thing, it would seem self explanatory. Nobody wants to employ fat dirty ugly people. Every company wants attractive employees. I think it's not different in America except that you just can't demand photos with an application. You have to wait and waste valuable company time with personal interviews before you can discover whether or not the applicant is a dog.

Come on, we all know that looks count in this world. Brutal yes, but true.
Posted by: chickadee

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/15/07 02:42 PM

Do you think looks overcome experience/education when a company is looking for an employee? Sad, brutal world sometimes. Fat, dirty, ugly people? Wow, that's a lot to have against one when job hunting. Fat and ugly sometimes can't be helped but dirty can wash up.

chick
Posted by: orchid

Re: Internat'l recruitment-marital status question - 03/16/07 06:34 AM

If the job is client-facing/client-oriented ....in order to drum up revenue for company, yes, looks might be influential in final hiring selection.

Well, come ON.....if you have 2 women equally qualified by education, same work experience and time spent, both good intelligent people with good personal characteristics, who is going to be remembered?

OTherwise that far less attractive woman must have a dynamic /charasmatic personality. It boils down for the hiring manager/managment team, who do you feel most comfortable to share coffee with and who will stick with the firm for awhile to make employee training investment pay off?