I posted this at the end of "I need your advice" but it's been so long since I'd posted there I wasn't sure if anyone would notice...I just wanted ya'll to know that it's over (as far as we're concerned)...wooooooooooooo hooooooooooo!!!

UPDATE!!!!
The truck is gone. I did it. I stuck to my guns and Larry and I drove it over to LW's brother's house yesterday. To make a long story short...I gave LW until this past weekend with no more time and no options. He kept stalling for more time and I sat down one night and wrote him a heart-to-heart email and talked to him as if he were my own son...I talked to him about what it means to be a responsible adult, to clean up ones messes instead of leaving it for ones parents to do, especially at the age of 26, and I talked to him about some other things that I felt needed to be addressed concerning his dad. I knew I was taking a risk of him more or less telling me to MYOB, but he didn't. Two days before I sent the email to LW, his dad sent him an email asking him when he'd be moving the truck...Larry's always let his kids call the shots and it's been a learning experience for Larry to step up and maintain control of this situation, but in the end, he did and I'm so proud of him. Yesterday, LW met us at his brother's house and we spent a few minutes with him. He was fine and now the truck is his brother's problem. Hopefully, it won't sit another year before it's finally dealt with. It's between LW and his brother now.
It was difficult for me to keep having to push my husband to do the right thing and it was hard for me to step in and finally explain to LW my views on responsibility and being a man about one's bills. He's still obsessed in the old truck he bought and despite all the money he's poured into it, it still will not run. And I also explained (gently) to him his dads and my views about when he leaves the military and if he hasn't saved his money in order to secure an apartment. My husband says from what he's been able to see that it's going to be a long time before LW gets his act together concerning spending money he doesn't have and the bankruptcy didn't teach him anything. JJ, like you, I'm a believer of tough love when it's called for and it was necessary in this situation because had we not insisted, nothing would have been done and the truck would still be sitting outside rusting and LW not caring.
If nothing else comes from this I know that LW understands that at least when it comes to me and his dad that we'll be fair with him but we're not afraid to press him to do the right thing when necessary.
Thanks for everyone's advice...it was greatly appreciated. I can always count on support when I come here...and I'm sure, as a step-mom, that I'll be back.

Dr. Phil had a line today, it was "What do you REQUIRE of him?" in terms of the good for all concerned. that's what this sounds like, right?

Right...all the way around good.

... and now we wait for Chapter Two, where you tell us how proud you are of him and what he has done with the truck.
Two thumbs UP, dee.

Gee, Dee...now you can plant a flower bed in form of a truck. Just so it won't look soooo empty.

Dee, I'm so glad you've found some resolve in this situation! You and Larry must be breathing easier....good for you!!

Dee, thank goodness this problem is resolved! And for for you, sticking to your guns.

Yep...THAT problem is resolved, thank goodness.

This happened yesterday. Yesterday, was my husband's birthday and I had a surprise get-together at his mom's house...nothing big because everyone was working and it just happened that Larry was going to be home for a few hours so I quickly put together a cake and his presents and ran them over to his mom's the night before. I didn't invite Larry's kids because LW's in another state and his other son and daughter could not take off work. It ended up being me, Larry, his mom and his sister...which was nice.
During the day Larry's brother from Virginia called and my son, (Larry's step-son) Ray, called to wish him a happy birthday. As the evening wore on there was no phone call from LW and no phone call from his daughter, Danielle. Finally, around 9 p.m. Larry went to lie down in bed and watch TV. I got on the internet and emailed LW and Danielle (she was online) and gently reminded them that it was their dad's birthday. Ten minutes later Danielle at least sent him an e-card, and despite the fact that she only lives 15 minutes away, did not pick up the phone and call her dad. And LW, instead of sending his dad an email or calling him, emailed me and made excuses that he never remembers anyone's birthday and to tell his dad happy birthday. So, why didn't he just send his father an email?
I'm just of the opinion that these two are selfish, self-centered brats who only think of themselves. It's not been a week ago that I had the heart-felt talk with LW about stepping up to the plate and being there more for his dad and he knew it was his Father's birthday because I'd told him about the new chainsaw I'd given him a week early. It obviously went in one ear and out the other...Larry, of course was hurt and told me today that his kids are selfish and they take after their mom...it was always about her and no one else. It's obvious who they took after.
This past Christmas Larry and I put so much time and money and effort into his children's gifts and having a good time with them here...they came in with NOTHING for their dad, got their gifts, ate, and left. It just stuns me that there are kids who can do this and be okay about it. Their Father is a sweet, considerate man who would go to the ends of the earth for his kids...but, will they take two minutes and say 'happy birthday, dad'? Too much trouble for them. I do not understand grown adult children who do this.
I've gotta stop or I could go on and on...UGH!!!

Are Larry's children adults Dee? If they are I would take them aside maybe to lunch together or separately and ask why they feel it ias okay to "INSULT" their father? Yes, I said "INSULT," because thats what they are doing. I had a similar problem with my step grandkids, adults doing the same thing. Then not even saeing a thank you for the gifts they themselves received. Until I used the word "INSULT" they hadn't a clue...
Now, problem solved with no hard feelings and my son will never know because I swore them to secrecy, and they know better then to mess with grandma...LOL!

Chatty...Larry's children don't care what I have to say...well, they do if it's what they want to hear. Believe me, if I thought it would do any good I would, but I've known them for over 4 years and they just don't care. His daughter is 30, middle son 27, youngest 26. I'm glad your talk got results...you were lucky. Maybe I should have you talk to them.

Jeez, bunch of ingrates. Daughter lives 15 minutes away and was a no show, no call? What's up with that?

Hey I'll take a shot, Maybe when they hear that others know how shameful they are behaving, it might shake them up...Maybe there should be no gifts or dinner next year, the two of you spend the time somewhere nice together. Whats good for the goose, is good for the ganders.

PL...I believe the word is selfish.

Chatty...I wish.

Dee, I SO get this! It is very much along the lines of my two so-called step-daughters. They are two of the most selfish, hateful young women I've ever known. They're ages 27 and 25. For the past 7 years since my husband's divorce, they stayed around, taking everything they could get from their Dad. Even when I came into the picture, we had Christmas Eves together which now we believe only happened for what they could get. Example: Two years ago, he bought the oldest daughter (a single, working mother) a new computer, loaded to the max with all the bells and whistles. When she finally got it hooked up 3 months later, she gave him her email address on the same day as the hook up. He excitedly emailed her and she never returned it, even though she later admitted to receiving it. They've never "had the time" to call, never responded to his calls to just say hi, forgotten his birthday, groaned loudly about Father's Day where it was never convenient or was "no big deal" as they would say. And thank you's??? Forget that...never happened. This has gone on forever. Finally Frank came to his breaking point when the oldest daughter threw a dramatic fit at him on her birthday when he wanted to treat she and the granddaughter to a day at the fair. That was 1 year and 4 months ago. Everyone stopped talking at that point. We went through the holidays with no word even though he sent cards and gift certificates...never a thanks...nothing. Last year he went to each daughter privately and tried to get to the bottom of this. The meetings were sweet and full of tears and he never heard from either one again. Later we found out there had been lies to make him feel bad, etc. We also found out that the younger daughter was ripped at him because he didn't offer "enough" money toward her $30,000.00 "princess wedding." She threw us out of the wedding plans and UNinvited us to the wedding which was last August and probably one of the worst days Frank has ever endured. The older daughter banned us from her life because her grandfather had only left money to Frank almost three years ago and NOT her!!!! These two have stomped on his heart like I've never seen before. After the wedding, I've watched him become more hardened than ever toward his kids. He took them off his life insurance, out of his will and has pretty much written them off from everything. They feel they're entitled to everything and the only thing that speaks to them is MONEY, plain and simple. It's sad to see him have to go cold toward them just to protect his feelings and he's a very sensitive man. And this same man has been the one that has driven miles in snowstorms to fill their cupboards, create a birthday or Christmas for his granddaughter when times were tough, get the younger one out of scrapes she's gotten into, fix cars in the freezing cold so they'd have wheels...arrrrrrrghhhhhhh! Okay, I'll stop but I realize the intense feelings that selfish children can make happen. I'm so angry at them...you wouldn't believe it. But their sole allegiance is to their mother who has effectively taught them to lie, cheat and steal...whatever will benefit their entitled little pointed heads. She can have them!

P.S. SO THERE !!!!!! Now I have to go take my blood pressure medicine.

Don't ask me why I'm doing this. I don't know. Beautiful daughters, gorgeous granddaughter...all people that we should have some kind of relationship with. We've never been anything other than loving, inviting and giving to these girls and yet we feel so trashed and I hurt for my husband so much. This was taken at our wedding in Oct. 2004 when things were better. Younger daughter on left, Frank, older daughter and granddaughter. It's just so sad and hard for me to imagine. My daughter is a doll and loves us both and remains close. Weird.

LadyJane, were the daughters jealous of you? You all look so happy in the picture. It is sad that they aren't trying from their side at all.

Maybe there are families who never have issues...but I don't know of any. Believe me, I have them with my own sons off and on too. Funny, I actually get along better with my DIL's. I think sons are more difficult because they need to be independent and show their independence by being sarcastic or nasty while they think they are funny. I don't know. I have learned though, to allow it to go in one ear and out the other. It doesn't always work,...and sometimes the stuff between the ears gets messed up,...but the things we do for harmony; sad to say is sometimes degrading.

Most importantly you are on your husband’s side. That’s all that counts, because in the end it’s all about us and our partners if we have one. Children move away, lead their own lives, and don’t think half as much about us as we think of them.

I know when I’m old and needy, that I have to see how I can be helped, because I know that my sons would never do for me what I do for my mother. Sad, but it’s better to face the truth now and be prepared.

So true, Hannelore. That's how my husband has come to feel...that we have to live OUR lives. If they come back someday, they'll have to prove themselves before we could ever trust them. But either way, we have to move forward. The ball's in their court now. It's just such a heartbreak. They're so unbelievable. I feel so much for him because I can't imagine just being thrown away by my own children. They definitely have issues and will have to learn the hard way. Of course, what's particularly hard is to have no contact with Alexis, the granddaughter. That is what's really sad. She's 6 now. We got married on her third birthday and she was our little flower girl. By the way, the photo is of hubby and his daughters and granddaughter. I wasn't in it. In fact, I still don't know why I posted it. I really got wound up talking about this!

Ladyjane, get yourself some good chocolate, put your feet up and listen to Benny Goodman. I wish I could walk with you over those cliffs on the ocean shore, and we would just breathe in that salty air.
You watch that heart of yours, you hear.

LJ, my youngest son and his wife were living in my home and enjoying all the advantages of living in a resort and paying no rent can bring. They were here a couple of years and he suddenly changed, became moody and mean, long story short, he was hooked on drugs. He bacame abusive to his wife and one night during a fight between them I stepped in and let him know I didn't raise my sons to abuse women or drugs. He said then we're moving out! I said okay, after offering to pay for himto go get help, whatever it took. He said, He said he didn't have a problem, I did and that they were moving out. Okay then, BYE!!! LJ, that was 1n 1994 and I haven't seen or heard from them since. Sometimes no matter what, we as parents have to put our foot down and accept the consequences, its that or allow the to run over top of us, disrespecting us and what we stand for...

Chatty...I believe you did the thing a loving parent should do. It's terrible what happened but you could not stand by and let your son abuse his wife...and I daresay that he probably would have started abusing you had you allowed him to stay. The trouble with kids today, I think, is there are no consequences...I hear kids all the time smart mouth their parents in stores, demand this or that, pitch fits while their parents walk on egg shells around them so the kids won't get their feelings hurt. Screw their feelings. You did the right thing. Maybe one day your son will change and maybe one day he'll come back and thank you for showing him tough love. Chatty...my heart goes out to you.

Chatty, so true. My gosh, 1994? That was 14 years ago...wow. How ridiculous! But we may be facing the same with one or both of his daughters. Who knows if they'll ever get the feeling that they need their Dad? The oldest is really the only one I hold out hope for in some small way. These ungrateful kids of ours!!!!!! It's sad because someday it's going to be too late for them. I pray they'll all see the light before then, but as I've said...we have to live our lives, too with or without.
Hannelore, if you ever come to Maine, we'll make the trek up to Pemaquid Point and sit on those rocks. In summer and Fall it's wonderful...today it wouldn't be...we're in a snowy weather pattern and it just won't quit.

Reading thru this thread has been very very thought provoking. Two of my adult children, 28 and 31 yrs old, are very similiar to what you all describe here. Some of you have taken definitive action..which is something my x-husband, their father..has advocated for quite awhile. I am the one that always sees the WHY and WHEREFORE behind things or tries to. But I am wondering if I am not too understanding for their own good and ours..my x-hubby´s and my own.

Very interesting thoughts here because I really do see where you all had to put your foot down and make a stand.

Glad to see you back Humlan...I've missed you...but, we all have to take a break from time to time.

I've tried to stay away from this because I, too, have a habit of trying to see the WHYs and WHEREFOREs. I think it comes from being the child of parents who didn't care to understand who I am, how I think and what I believe. Instead of guiding me, they ignored me or thumped me with a Bible (preached to me, in other words), or shamed me. I think through the eyes of that child. Residual feelings make me question backgrounds.

Gimster...part of this wonderful site is to allow us to share all kinds of experiences we are going through or have gone through depending upon where we want to vent...I'm sorry that your parents didn't see the wonderful child they had in front of them....I sometimes wonder if it wasn't that generation for the most part. I understand and emphatize with you sweetheart...and my arms are around you. I'm sending hug angels your way to keep you company. Take care sweetheart. We care about you.

I have no steps, but just spent some time reading all of this thread. What I take from all of this is that we need to focus on what we have and not what may never be. We sure as hell, can't change others, no matter how hard we try. We can choose our own happiness by focusing on our good marriages, which several among us have. I thnk it's awesome that those of you having issues with steps, have the support of your spouses, or are on the same page regarding the ungrateful adult kids.

Dotsie...I have an incredible, loving marriage and once my husband saw his children's tries at manipulating him against me, he realized he had one of two choices. Move in with his kids or be my husband. He'd been so used to them manipulating him and also let guilt of the divorce (it wasn't his fault...his ex left him for some younger computer geek who ended up dumping her) allow his kids to more or less call the shots. I've bent over backward to be supportive of his adult children and the only time we clash is when they try to walk on him...and because it's no longer tolerated (or at the very least it's met with resistence when necessary), they come around less. So, it makes me wonder how much do they really love their Father...or was it just for what they could get out of him all along?
Their lack of showing love and respect to him is one reason that I make sure that Larry knows he's loved by me. I go the extra mile in doing things for him...I want him to have no doubt how I feel and how important he is to me. I feel that one day his kids will grow up (probably in the mid-30's or there about) and start to see how wrong they've been during the past 3 years.
On the other side of the coin I've tried to see things from their side...not an easy thing to do sometimes when they've been so defiant and mean-spirited, but I'm sure after them living a pretty good life and getting pretty much what they want from a Father who was easily manipulated has been like hitting a brick wall for them since he's been married to me.
My SIL has been the biggest support for me during the hard times with my SC and I go to her for feedback and advice. Not one time has she nor any of Larry's family come back and said what Larry's kids have done to him is fair and just. Sometimes they've been outright appauled at their behavior...and Larry's past birthday was another disappointment for him.
I've decided that next Christmas I'm not going to do anything for LW and Danielle...they've continued to ignore their Father time and time again and I cannot keep handing them gifts of love when they do not return anthing to him. It may be wrong of me but I just cannot find it in my heart at the moment. I'm tired of seeing my sweet husband's hurt face and knowing that they could give a rip less. If he wants to do something for them, that's his choice...but, I've done all I'm doing until something changes.
You're right, Dotsie...you cannot change people...but I can change how I do things...and I'm going to give them what they give their Father...nothing.

Dee, it might be easier if you and Larry scheduled a vacation AWAY for a week (or even a weekend) during holidays and celebrations, so you waste no time wondering "What if they call? or come over?" because they won't be able to.

The money you would've spent on them -- use it during vacation for a super-nice dinner or even a fun souvenir. You both deserve it.

Thats what I said too Dee. It is the best. and probably the only way to teach these leeches a lesson. Plus think of all the fun you and your man will have alone somewhere during the holidays...Oh and leave the jammies at home!!

LOL...chatty you make me chuckle...I'll leave the PJ's home for sure...LOL. Merideth...good idea...haven't thought of that and it certainly would help, I think.
Things are turning out the way I thought they would concerning LW and him getting out of the military and not being prepared. He sent his dad an email a couple of days ago and said he now wishes he'd bought a different vehicle (one that actually runs..He's spent a lot of money trying to fix up a 1989 truck that still will not start). He said he's getting out probably in March and can't get an apartment because of his bankruptcy and his bad credit. (I knew that was coming)...Then he said he'd have to live with his Mom and sister. DIDN'T I PREDICT THIS???? He's not certain of a job yet and hasn't saved any money and will pile in on his mom and sister and all Larry and I can do is shake our heads. Unbelieveable!!!

Okay Dee, so where'd you go for Valentinee day and what kind of an evening was it?

Chatty...if you read my post under Valentine's Day you'll find out...it was nice!!!

Yep, did read it and have one comment, WOW!!!